How to keep the pax while changing aircraft?

English Boards Community Support
1

Is that even possible?

Here's my case:

I have a schedule on aircraft A, with 80 seats.

This aircraft has flown for weeks, carrying passengers.

It also has 3 days in advance booked flights.

All of them are full books. And always are.

Then, I have a new aircraft. Which is aircraft B, with 120 seats.

Yes, this is different aircraft.

And yes, I know the risk of having different overall flight time between the two aircraft.

I am planning to move the schedule from aircraft A to aircraft B.

And of course, due to different overall flight time, I won't be able to create the exact same flight schedule time for all of them.

Instead, I am taking 50% of the aircraft A to be moved to aircraft B.

Let say, route C to D at 8.00 am. Moved to B, still at 8.00 am. This route has 100% full booked for the next three days.

My question:

Will this 100% be flown by the aircraft B for the next 3 days? Of course, I did the changing before the flight happen. Let say, at least two or four hours prior to departure.

I don't expect a full booked on aircraft B. A 100% in A is 80 pax, so I was hoping this 80 pax will move to B. I don't expect it became 120, of course, just 80 pax. I don't care if the 40 empty seats were not filled. I am just questioning, can I keep the pax while changing aircraft?

Thank you.

2

Hi,

if you use the same flight number(i.e. remove it from aircraft A and assign it to B ) all already booked flights(I.e. next three days) will be flown by A, but any new bookings are on B. After three days you should get at least 80 pax, if the route supports it also more, up to 120 in your case, if the ORS rating is the same or better.

3

As duo said, already-booked flights will be flown on already-booked aircraft. After you transfer flights to the new a/c, all newly booked flights (72+ hours) will be booked and flown by the new a/c. For this reason i keep a "pending" fleet, where I move both old and new a/c and check several times positioning etc.so the new a/c can be positioned properly, and the old a/c scheduled with new flights. Also one more thing - even after you move schedule to new a/c, already booked flights will keep on filling on old a/c until you reach 100% LF.

4

Yes, of course, I do use the same flight number.

Thats the point of changing the aircraft.

So that means, anytime I'm going to change aircraft, I need to cancel 3 days in advance then move it to new aircraft, and wait for 3 days?

CMIIW.

Which also means, once a pax booked a flight with a certain aircraft, s/he will never fly any other aircraft even if I change the aircraft before the flight happen?

5

So that means, anytime I'm going to change aircraft, I need to cancel 3 days in advance then move it to new aircraft, and wait for 3 days?

You have to wait three days only once...the flights already booked will be flown by the old aircraft and then after three days the new aircraft takes over...

Which also means, once a pax booked a flight with a certain aircraft, s/he will never fly any other aircraft even if I change the aircraft before the flight happen?

That is correct. Already booked flights can't be changed at all (I think the only exception is  a change within the assigned (but not a totally new one, i.e. if you change the old one, but do not create a new one) service profile - I think this is effective immediatly). This also applies to seating configurations, if you change it the already booked flights will still use the old seats and then after three days you will see the new seats.

6

So my conclusion, its impossible to move pax for tomorrow to another "aircraft".

Sorry, but Im still confused with this:

You have to wait three days only once...the flights already booked will be flown by the old aircraft and then after three days the new aircraft takes over...

When I'm going to change aircraft, I am planning to use the same flight number.

How can I make a schedule of new aircraft if the flight number still used by the old aircraft?

I mean, is there a way of doing that?

Because in my lack-of-knowledge thought, due to those new conclusions:

I have to cancel all flights after three days, then when I dont have any flight booked, I move that flight number to new aircraft, and then wait another 3 days. So total, its 6 days. <- But this was what I thought. (I'm hoping I'm wrong and there is another correct way. Hehe.)

Sorry if I make everyone confused, hehe... but please, I dont understand about this...

:D

To make it clear, I am not moving pax to a new aircraft...

I want to move a flight number to a new aircraft without losing the pax who has already booked with that flight number...

I was reaching the point where, "okay, thats impossible," until duo stated again that I only need 3 days only to change that flights... and that makes me confused again.. hahaha...

sorry, sorry...

But then i got a new question as you were stating that

I think the only exception is  a change within the assigned (but not a totally new one, i.e. if you change the old one, but do not create a new one, service profile - I think this is effective immediatly

Does it mean:

I have flight XX123 on aircraft A, at 8.00 am.

Today i change it to 8.30 am. (Of course changed it hours before 8.00 am)

The pax will still fly.

Correct me if i'm wrong.

I'm still confused with these changing thing.

7

If flight 123 is booked and activated already at 8, and you change it to 830. It will depart at 8 for the next 72 hours (check the flight tab to see what’s been booked) and then it will go to 830

8

If flight 123 is booked and activated already at 8, and you change it to 830. It will depart at 8 for the next 72 hours (check the flight tab to see what's been booked) and then it will go to 830

Whoaaa... now i get it!

Thank you thank you... :D

9

If you can still have old a/c, the pax already booked on that old a/c will not disappear for as long as the plane stays in your fleet during those mentioned 3 days.

You can easily switch over the flight number to the new plane. Go to the flight scheduling, click the "i" in circle icon ("view flight number"), then click on scheduling, click on "selected aircraft", type in the new a/c registration number, then two lines down in "flight day selection" click on "all" so it selects all scheduled days (or click on just some days if your schedule for that flight is not 7 days) and as the last step, click the "Apply schedule settings" green button.

If flight times (aircraft speed) are same, no further adjustment is necessary. If the new a/c is slower or faster, your new schedule will need to be time-adjusted. It's always better to move schedule to a faster, rather than slower, aircraft... that way you can keep your scheduled departure times, even though arrival times will be sooner (slot permitting).

10

One thing the others didn't mention (at least as far as I saw)... certain types of aircraft have different turn-around times at different airports. Your times will have to be adjusted if you are changing from a regional jet (like a CRJ) to a narrow-body like an A318 or 737.

11

If you can still have old a/c, the pax already booked on that old a/c will not disappear for as long as the plane stays in your fleet during those mentioned 3 days.

You can easily switch over the flight number to the new plane. Go to the flight scheduling, click the "i" in circle icon ("view flight number"), then click on scheduling, click on "selected aircraft", type in the new a/c registration number, then two lines down in "flight day selection" click on "all" so it selects all scheduled days (or click on just some days if your schedule for that flight is not 7 days) and as the last step, click the "Apply schedule settings" green button.

If flight times (aircraft speed) are same, no further adjustment is necessary. If the new a/c is slower or faster, your new schedule will need to be time-adjusted. It's always better to move schedule to a faster, rather than slower, aircraft... that way you can keep your scheduled departure times, even though arrival times will be sooner (slot permitting).

And now Im getting more confused. Hahaha.

But thats okay. I'm so glad that everyone here are helping me.

Does that means:

Aircraft A, full schedule, and booked for the next 72 hours.

Then, I delete all the schedule, move it to new aircraft, and leave the aircraft A empty from any schedule, buuuttt.. the flight for booked flight still listed in aircraft A, aaanndd.. aircraft A will still fly for that booked flight, no matter it has no schedule in it??

Is that correct?

12

All right, I have checked it and found out that YES, all flight number that has been moved to new aircraft, but listed on the 3 days advance of old aircraft, still flown by the OLD aircraft. All full pax, and all with full income.

Buuutttt....

The fixed cost increased 5 times!!

Which finally give me loss.

The fixed cost usually around $2,000 now it changed to $10,000 since the flight plan is empty, but the flight executed...

Hahaha..

Does that means AS was giving me penalty for flying aircraft with no flight plan?

If yes, that would be understandable.

Maybe I just need some clarification. :D

13

It's fixed cost as you said - so with your different/empty flight plan now, it's just allocated differently.

14
Does that means:

Aircraft A, full schedule, and booked for the next 72 hours.

yes

Then, I delete all the schedule, move it to new aircraft, and leave the aircraft A empty from any schedule,

yes ... you must delete (or transfer) schedule from the old a/c ... you must not wait until 3 days are over, because if you leave the schedule on old a/c new days will be booked and it will never end :)

buuuttt.. the flight for booked flight still listed in aircraft A,

yes even if you delete schedule, flights already booked will remain booked. Unless your a/c is returned to lessor, for as long as that plane remains in your fleet, flights that are booked on it will be flown. fleet

aaanndd.. aircraft A will still fly for that booked flight, no matter it has no schedule in it??

that's correct

AND ... two ways to move schedule (adjusting times, of course, as may be required)

1) deleting schedule and then going to new plane scheduling, but selecting "existing flight number" in the top left instead of "new flight number", then looking up the flight number in pull-down menu, then selecting "all" or "specific" days then applying changes to schedule.

2) Through flight scheduling page, as I indicated above.

Method 2 is more secure because you do not run the risk of losing departure/arrival slot (unless time change is necessary).

15
Does that means AS was giving me penalty for flying aircraft with no flight plan?

If yes, that would be understandable.

Maybe I just need some clarification. :D

Flight costing tab is just indicative. If you have one flight booked on a  plane the flight costing will be different than I you have 8 daily flights booked.

Flight costing is a virtual number... it reflects existing cost but spread among the booked flights. If your flights get cancelled or added, it changes.

For example, you will keep to bear cost of lease on the old a/c until it is returned to lessor or scheduled for a new route. But of course you will not pay navigation fees, etc. You will also pay pilot wages, and crew fees. The only way to avoid additional pilot and crew fees would be to let the old a/c fly 3 days, and THEN move schedule AND pilots (if same a/c type). The crew would move automatically. If you have both planes "active" you will have double pilots and crew.

16

Hi,

the basic answer to your question is no, you cannot move passengers from one plane to another.

The ORS books passengers on a given flight. If you for example cancel that flight, these passengers won't look for another flight. They simply vanish in cyber space.

And you cannot change flights that are already in the system. If you move a return flight from plane one to plane two, plane one will perform the flights that are already on its flight list. Plane two will start the first flight three days later, with other passengers.

The same goes for changing the on-board service. If you improve the service, today's flight will immediately look better if you check the flight detail page. But if you check the ORS rating, you will see that today's flight still has the old ORS rating. The real ORS ratings will only improve three days from now, when the new flights with the better service are in the ORS system. Once a flight is in the ORS system, you cannot change it anymore.

As for the cost, that was already explained. if you remove 50% of the flights from your flight schedule, the leasing cost for the remaining flight doubles. Obviously they don't really double, and you only pay the leasing cost once per week anyway. But the flight detail page divides the leasing cost (and salaries) by the number of flights and gives you an estimated cost.

Jan