Sooo, it has been nearly half a year since a US-Cuba post has been posted and so, I thought I would ask looking for an update.
Still, as was the case in the post last November, all major U.S.-based carriers fly to multiple cities in Cuba based off of the lifting of restrictions by the Obama Administration. The Trump administration hasn't reversed the policy and hasn't signaled that they will, either.
Will we be able to fly to Cuba soon?
Simple answer is it is not unrestricted travel. An American citizen may only go on one of these flights if they fall into 1 of 5 categories. Tourism is not one of them at the moment. Until all restrictions are lifted I doubt they will be made available. Even if they were the number of passengers would be minimal. I understand a few airlines have pulled off Cuba
Actually, the answer for airlines is not that simple. I'm speaking on the behalf of an U.S. airline, not citizen, and for the airline, it is unrestricted travel.
An American citizen may only go on one of these flights if they fall into 1 of 5 categories
Yes, but not just U.S. citizens fly on airlines based out of the United States. U.S. airlines have passengers that fly from all over the world. Interlining partners could also allow US-Cuba flights to at least break-even.
Just the non-U.S. citizens in the United States alone would justify a flight or two from some of the bigger airlines.
Tourism is not one of them at the moment
I wasn't aware that the AS model was only dedicated to tourist travel. Just because U.S. citizen can't go be a tourist in a country doesn't mean an airline cannot fly there, which is exactly the case in Cuba at the moment. Many countries have restrictions, maybe not as stringent as Cuba's, but restrictions the same.
Until all restrictions are lifted I doubt they will be made available. Even if they were the number of passengers would be minimal. I understand a few airlines have pulled off Cuba.
This is the biggest part of what doesn't make sense... the current restrictions in place are on a certain class of people, U.S. citizens, NOT actual airlines. Regardless of the restrictions on people, by the statement of a few airlines choosing to pull out of Cuba shows that airlines are able to fly to Cuba (unrestricted), just maybe not with as many passengers as they would like.
Again, just because there are certain people restrictions, if airlines are allowed to fly, they should be able to fly and compete. Obviously, airlines outside of the United States stand to benefit the most to not allowing U.S. airlines to compete based on our proximity to the country and possible dilution of the market. Continuing to bar U.S.-based carriers from travel to Cuba therefore creates a competitive advantage for foreign airlines if both the U.S. and Cuban governments have lifted the restrictions on airlines traveling back and forth from each country.
Actually, the answer for airlines is not that simple. I'm speaking on the behalf of an U.S. airline, not citizen, and for the airline, it is unrestricted travel.
No it is not simple by a long shot, and unfortunately the restrictions and traffic patterns are well outside the realm of what AS can do. As soon as it can't be simulated accurately then it's usually not implemented until it can be. I
Interlining partners could also allow US-Cuba flights to at least break-even.
In real life they must be issued separate tickets for different airlines, ie self connecting. As we know self connecting at the moment is not simulated.
I wasn't aware that the AS model was only dedicated to tourist travel. Just because U.S. citizen can't go be a tourist in a country doesn't mean an airline cannot fly there, which is exactly the case in Cuba at the moment. Many countries have restrictions, maybe not as stringent as Cuba's, but restrictions the same.
So there are actually 13 different classes allowed instead of 5. At the moment a limitation of AS is there is only 1 class of passenger (reason to travel), in the future there are going to be more...I suspect that may help the situation (or maybe I'm totally wrong). But again if it can't be simulated, it probably won't get added.
This is the biggest part of what doesn't make sense... the current restrictions in place are on a certain class of people, U.S. citizens, NOT actual airlines. Regardless of the restrictions on people, by the statement of a few airlines choosing to pull out of Cuba shows that airlines are able to fly to Cuba (unrestricted), just maybe not with as many passengers as they would like.
I'm sorry I didn't really make my point clear. It's really two fold thinking about it. Traffic data in AS is based on whole year data, not half a year. Until you have a year you cannot realistically expect it to be added. The second is that if the demand is soo low realistically in AS you wouldn't be able to run more than 3 daily flights (allowing for more competitors). It's that low that a big airline would not be fussed about it, as they can make more money elsewhere, and it would be more of "it would be nice" rather than "i really need this"
My last point to add is that the traffic rights appear to only be one way. Only American airlines are flying to Cuba, not Cuban airlines to USA. Again there is absolutely zero way of simulating this in AS
Actually, the answer for airlines is not that simple. I'm speaking on the behalf of an U.S. airline, not citizen, and for the airline, it is unrestricted travel.
Yes, but not just U.S. citizens fly on airlines based out of the United States. U.S. airlines have passengers that fly from all over the world. Interlining partners could also allow US-Cuba flights to at least break-even.
Just the non-U.S. citizens in the United States alone would justify a flight or two from some of the bigger airlines.
Well, I hate to break it to you but the airline doesn't decide what's unrestricted travel. That would be the US government.
It is by very definition restricted travel, as you need to meet one of number of specific travel categories. General tourism is still illegal. Foreign travellers are no better off than US tourists, they still have to apply for a licence.
https://help.cbp.gov/app/answers/detail/a_id/243/~/traveling-outside-of-the-u.s.---travel-to-cuba
Well, I hate to break it to you but the airline doesn’t decide what’s unrestricted travel. That would be the US government.
This is my point. The U.S. government decided that airlines can fly to Cuba , unrestricted. It's U.S. citizens that cannot. I'm trying to point out the difference between the restrictions on U.S. citizens vs. U.S. based airlines.
This is my point. The U.S. government decided that airlines can fly to Cuba , unrestricted. It's U.S. citizens that cannot. I'm trying to point out the difference between the restrictions on U.S. citizens vs. U.S. based airlines.
Incorrect - it's ANY passenger departing from the USA, whether they are a US citizen or not. A Brit or Australian can't just fly into Miami and hop on a flight into HAV. They have to go through the same approval process as anyone else (and why would you? Easier to fly via MEX or CAN).
Rather than arguing about the semantics of whether it's unrestricted for the airline (it's not, the US DOT has to approve and there is a daily cap of 20 flights into HAV; but then again most international flights are restricted without an open skies treaty) - the fact that the passengers are restricted, and airline sim is all about passengers, is reason enough to put this on ice.
Airlines are restricted too as pointed above. Cuban airlines may not fly to US. There is no way of simulating one way traffic rights at the moment. Hence why a European airline cannot fly to the USA from any European country, just their home country
Incorrect - it's ANY passenger departing from the USA, whether they are a US citizen or not. A Brit or Australian can't just fly into Miami and hop on a flight into HAV. They have to go through the same approval process as anyone else (and why would you? Easier to fly via MEX or CAN).
Actually it's you who is incorrect. Our very own CBE flew from MIA to HAV and I don't think he had to do any approval process. He is Swedish.
http://community.airlinesim.aero/topic/11005-trip-report-cuba
Actually it's you who is incorrect. Our very own CBE flew from MIA to HAV and I don't think he had to do any approval process. He is Swedish.
http://community.airlinesim.aero/topic/11005-trip-report-cuba
So it's not a formal licence anymore, but it's still restricted. First line: Flying to Cuba from or through the U.S. for tourism is not allowed. Also: You must check in at the airport to provide reason for travel
https://www.aa.com/i18n/plan-travel/destinations/cuba.jsp?anchorLocation=DirectURL&title=cuba
So it's not a formal licence anymore, but it's still restricted. First line: Flying to Cuba from or through the U.S. for tourism is not allowed. Also: You must check in at the airport to provide reason for travel
https://www.aa.com/i18n/plan-travel/destinations/cuba.jsp?anchorLocation=DirectURL&title=cuba
Well technically yes, and practically no. According to the lonely planet reports I am reading right now, European tourists are just handed a paper form on board the aircraft whee they have to circle a category, and after they hand it back to FA nobody cares any more. Most Europeans select the "Support for the Cuban people" option. Some also select “self-guided” people-to-people exchange program. :-) yeah ... self guided people to people exchange program... sounds funny. There is no check or verification of the option selected on the form.
I did not circle anything and still got through though I had to calculate the value of everything I was carrying even my headphones. As I did not write that much in that topic about the actual process I will do it here:
I was going through flights and my options where either flying with an European carrier which is ridiculously expensive for flights to Cuba or what I did which is flying Norwegian from CPH to FLL then American or Spirit to and from Cuba and later FLL to CPH. I had my Norwegian flight on the 24th of December where I only need an ESTA and a passport. As I never know when I will need to reach America I always have a valid ESTA just in case. As my Cuban/Swedish friends where coming on the 31st I got a week in South Florida which has since a long time been one of my favorite places. I stayed two nights in Ft Lauderdale and later took an Uber to Miami where I stayed five nights. I had previously bought a “Cuba Visa” from a travel agency in Copenhagen which needed no whatsoever check (they didn’t even look at my passport).
What surprised me was that 48 hours before departure with American Airlines from MIA to HAV American Airlines drastically tried calling me. I have flown a lot of times and never has an airline ever called me, the closest thing I have gotten to a call have been text messages. First I thought it was a scam so I didn’t answer but the second time I did while waiting to buy tickets a Sightseeing Bus. Then a very nice lady asked my reason for travel and I said “Tourism” which afterwards she started talking about 12 reason for travel to Cuba and tourism is not allowed almost like she was reading a page long monologue. During her Monologue I multiple times attempted to make her understand that I am not an American Citizen and I am Swedish. Finally she understood that I am not American Citizen and she asks me “Where do you then come from?” my Answer is “Sweden” then she says “That doesn’t exist”. My instinct at this point is attempting to describe my country so I describe how our flag is a yellow cross on a blue background and famous Swedish people. She still did not think my country existed. I told her to do a search and call me back when she found my country. After five minutes she calls back saying happily “I found your country and the 12 reasons dont matter in your circumstance”.
Afterwards she starts rambling on exactly what check in, what gate, that I need to get a couple of stamps at the airport, where they are, etc. I toold her that I am sorry but I cant remember all that please email it to my email address which I said. The email is as follows:
"Mr. Christian Palsson
Thank you for your time today regarding your upcoming trip to Cuba. The day of your flight, you will need check in with the American Airlines counter 8 in Terminal D. Once you receive your boarding pass, proceed to the Cuba Ready Station located before TSA Security Gate to receive a stamp on your boarding pass from our staff. Without this stamp, you will not be allowed in the plane. An additional Cuba Ready Station will be located near your boarding gate for your convenience between gates D12/D14 & D37. Your gate will be D14.
Check in Process
1) Check in with American Airlines to receive your boarding pass
2) Check in with Cuba Ready Station to receive your stamp
3) Proceed to boarding gate
4) Enjoy your trip!
Best Regards,"
When I arrived at the airport I went to the “Cuba section”. I immediately felt discriminated as I alerted help as my check in machine was broken but somehow every one who spoke spanish got higher priority than me. When boarding and deboarding I also got randomly pushed and multiple people being rude. Somehow I was the only person on that plane without a blood connection to Cuba. Anyways that did not continue and on Cuba everyone was extremely nice. I got a customs form and a healthcare form to fill in on the flight. The customs form was declaring whatever you are bringing in and how much it is worth and the healthcare form is whether you have various types of secretion or not. When I arrived at HAV there was this dark, warm horribly smelling control area where they took a picture of me using some 10$ webcam.
On my flight home (HAV - FLL with Spirit) there was nothing unusual except for that the ground crew where American and flew with us like they would in very remote places. As I had a short connection and the US has a stupid policy not allowing international passengers to connect I had to do all the immigration go out of the terminal and walk over to the Norwegian terminal. My Norwegian flight to CPH was completely normal. The flights this way cost only a third of what Air Berlin, Iberia or KLM would have charged me and I had a brilliant opportunity to revisit South Florida.