Is it even possible to make any profit whatsoever?

I'm probably not the only person saying this but I'm seriously starting to wonder if this site is scam. Everything I do seems to fail, I've read all the stuff on the Wiki and done what it suggests. I do dirt cheap flights with no competition and good service and I get, at best, 8 or 9 bookings per flight. 98 percent of my interlining requests are denied regardless of how beneficial they may be to business. I must have spent 30 or 40 pounds on credits and so far it's been a massive waste of money. If nothing changes by the time my current credits run out I'm giving up. Any suggestion that arn't "Read the wiki" are welcome, It's unlikely I haven't tried it but send them anyway.

Thanks 

Server and the Name of your company can help to have a look  :)

Indeed. I'm always willing to help, but need a little more information. I tried and failed for a couple years (with lots of time off in between, mind) and only after a lot of study did I really start to put things together.

@ BenjaminA330

Devau. Air Newcastle.

Well first of all I am not playing myself on devau so I am not sure what the general conditions like AGEX look like at the moment but a few things I can tell you.

You are so far operating 3 A318 to destinations all outside the UK. The thing is the 318 is not very economical and it is too big to start with on an old Server like Devau. You are flying to destinations that are all holiday destinatins but you are not having any network to fill your flights. For example if you want to fly from PRG to TLL it is better to fly direct or via FRA for example then via NCL. 

So what will bring you forward. If you are lucky someone will repond here who is actually playing on Devau and will help you and may give you a good starting point as well because Europe is never easy to start. I am playing on Meigs, Idlewild and Aspern and might give you a helping hand over there if you want.

For the moment, if you like to stay where you are in NCL........ get rid of the A318....... start with Dash8 if you like to start with Turboprops or with CRJ700 if you like to start with jets. Then start connecting all the airports within the UK where slots are available and try to expand your network in the UK first before you go international ..... even within Europe. You will not be able to start right of the way you did. And schedule daily flights. On those days where you are not flying and the passenger would like to travel with you he has to fly with your competitor because you are not offering the flight. So it is inconsistend.

Canadaboy, you must first conquer domestic market. International, will be much more difficult. Also interline, people will not like interlining with you if you are young and small.

Another option is to look for a different market with huge domestic traffic that is opened up. You need to review those markets every day on all servers, doing that for weeks, something will open up somewhere. I posted something about Fornebu just a few days ago.

If you want to play on a  different world, there are several places wide open:

examples:

Croydon: Panama City, Caracas

Stapleton: Panama City

* Panama - you can build north-south traffic like Copa, Caracas - same as Panama but you also have nice internal traffic in Venezuela.

Kaitak: Tel Aviv

Devau: Moscow SVO, USA: Denver (50%), Orlando (53%), Phoenix (47%), CLT (47%) and many major cities in USA with 20-30% slot availability (you could build a big US airline)

Meigs: Tel Aviv, Panama City, Jeddah, Mexico City (55%)

Thanks to all who replied. I will take it on board (excuse the pun) and give it a go.

Thanks to all who replied. I will take it on board (excuse the pun) and give it a go.

If you're still having any problems/questions, feel free to message me on Aspern, in on every day so except a quick reply :D

Canadaboy13, I can try and help you a little on Devau. If you are wanting to start from NCL I suggest you think about developing your airline based tightly on connecting flights. The big routes, for example, NCL-LHR, NCL-LGW etc are hard to earn a profit on, and there is already competition with large airlines with hubs in the London airports. The same applies too to NCL-AMS (AMS is a hub for a large European airline). However at the moment, the AGEX is good, which means that you have a better chance to get started. 

NCL is well located as a hub for flights from the UK into northern Europe, especially Germany and Scandinavia. You could feed an NCL hub with flights from GLA, EDI, PIK, BFS, BHD, LPL, LBA and more and try and connect them into European airports. I'd probably start with looking for European airports that are 5 bar+. Try looking in southern Norway and Sweden, Denmark and northern Germany. Most airports in this area will connect logically on the map - for example, if you flew from CPH to NCL and continued to BFS you're almost connecting in a straight line. AS passengers like efficient connections. 

Your choice of aircraft is really important. When starting you probably want to look at small efficient aircraft. Someone else has already suggested the Dash 8-Q400A (DH4) and CRJ-700 (CR7). You could lease at least 6 of these with your initial AS$ 10 million. If you lease bigger aircraft you are going to struggle to fill the seats without a larger network, so you have a better chance of filling smaller planes. Also, both the DH4 and CR7 turn around in 20 mins, which is efficient (a 737 will take 30). From NCL, I'd probably go for the CR7, but both should work. 

To make your connections work needs a little planning. The connection time for NCL is 1 hour. That means a passenger arriving at 10.00 can connect to any of your departing flights from 11.00. So, if you had flights coming in from 6 UK destinations at 10.00, and 6 flights leaving to non UK at 11.00 then any passenger from your incoming flights could connect onto any of your outgoing flights. You should be able to make at least two complete round trips per day (by round trip I mean flights from your UK feeder airports, return flight to the European airport, and back to the feeder airport). You might manage three. 

Whilst your network is growing, don't be tempted by the longer flights - you'll struggle to find enough passengers to fill them. So from NCL look for flights no longer than about 2 hours. Once your network grows you'll have a better chance of making them work, and you'll be able to afford to experiment more.

Be picky with your interlining partners. If you choose a partner who is too big, you will pay a lot of money to the staff to run it, and you may not get enough extra bookings to make it worthwhile. So if you were thinking about a couple of flights a day to Norway, then choose a partner with a good Norwegian domestic network; and so on.

Don't get too worried about the ORS to start with. If you are running a CR7 then try and choose a combination of seats, service and price that is above 85, 75 for a DH4 (finding out what works is just a matter of trial and error). A good connection in NCL is the most important thing, so try to make it exactly or as close to an hour as you can. 

I ran an airline from NCL last year and I can assure you it can work, and if you want any help message me in Devau. Don't be put off if your first attempts don't work, most of us have restarted many times on the way to building our airlines.

Another option is to look for a different market with huge domestic traffic that is opened up. You need to review those markets every day on all servers, doing that for weeks, something will open up somewhere.

In which way can you look for good markets? Is there some methods other than wander among airports and find some with enough slots and poor connections? It will take ages.

Thanks.

In which way can you look for good markets? Is there some methods other than wander among airports and find some with enough slots and poor connections? It will take ages.

 

Thanks.

It’s not the easiest method, but I take the Statistics/Enterprises-by-Country list, and run a comparison against the Country list. The statistic only lists countries with an active enterprise, so you look for the countries that don’t appear in the statistic list. It cuts down on the amount of time I spend clicking on random airports to see slot availability.

In which way can you look for good markets? Is there some methods other than wander among airports and find some with enough slots and poor connections? It will take ages.

Thanks.

Well... yes it will take ages and patience. You can also screen server home pages for liquidation announcements. But screening the servers and major airports, that's how I started my two companies on older servers, in huge markets with little service (presumably with a demise of big player there previously). Same happened with Beijing a few days ago.

Canada, What aircraft are you using? It is possible to make profit, but you must be patient, set yourself up and wait some days.

If nothing changes by the time my current credits run out I'm giving up.

Be patient. Take all your experiences as a learning-curve. Most players experienced the same at the beginning.

It took me a year to get a pretty average airline at best, one thing that was a big help was Alfa's tutorials on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL999FE6D0B80E5ADD.

They are rather long but if you have the time to watch them they are great. 

Same happened with Beijing a few days ago.

I'm trying to get the Beijing opportunity. Anyway, after few days I've started, a big Cargo company, fill all the routes with major Chinese airports, with big new planes, making the competition almost impossible (given my 20 years old 737-400).

I suppose that with patience I will be able to afford a new A320 or something similar, But will be a long journey.

Luperco, concentrate on passengers, cargo in short haul is not that important. Maybe lower somewhat the cargo price. In pax service a 20-y/o 734 will not have substantial ORS disadvantage against a new 737 or a320, tired and tested. It will affect your image, but if you have at least 4 star onboard service, decent seats, substantial flight attendants, positive staff mood (this is important) you should have no problems. A 20 y/o 737 with all that will give you maybe 1 point lower OTS rating on 1500-2500 km flights, and virtually zero ORS difference on <1500 km flights.

... A 20 y/o 737 with all that will give you maybe 1 point lower ORS rating on 1500-2500 km flights, and virtually zero ORS difference on <1500 km flights.

Hi,

and a 30 year old 727 will even give you an overall ORS rating of 100.

But as you also said, old planes hurt your airline image. My airline image is above 80. If your airline image is like 60, the ORS ratings will be different. And the difference will be more than one point  ;-)

Jan

Edit: I compared two subsidiaries that share some routes.

Airline one has an image of 80 for economy

The flight between BEY and DXB has an ORS rating of 58/98.

Airline two has an image of 83 for economy

The same flight has an ORS rating of 59/99.

All other variables seats, service, price... are the same.

Luperco, concentrate on passengers, cargo in short haul is not that important.

Sorry I expressed myself badly. The Cargo company found a subsidiary, and buy (or move from other routes, I don't know) a lot of new planes and fill the passengers market I'm trying to get with my few, old 737s.

Anyway, I cannot compete with him, but I have some profit so hopefully I'll slowly grow,

Speaking about company image now my staff mood is one bar red, Is raising the wages by 10% going over the country average enough to make the mood green? Or do you suggest to raise more than 10% (from the default value set when the company has been founded).

Thanks