Hey guys, I am new and just to check this game out I tried to start a new airline based in a very small airport in my country LEY / Lelystad. The reason for this is that there are plans to expand this tiny airport so it can serve as a secondary airport for Amsterdam.
Thing is, how do ,you make it work? There is no transfer possibility, and the game doesn't allow the airline to BUILD a transfer facility (WHY NOT?). So I am dependant on point-to-point traffic. The amount of traffic also seems to be a given and not subject to change; AMS has all the traffic and LEY none whatsoever. Even though many cities now can be reached with my airline, demand doesn't grow. Though demand determines supply, supply also determines demand, which is why small low-cost airports can exist.
So am I right in saying that only a standard hub and spoke mainline carrier can ever work in this game? Because then it would not be very close to the real world.
Just some statistics: I activated my schedule yesterday, and as of now most of my flights have 0 or maybe 1-2 passengers. There are a couple with, say, 13 passengers or so, and that's it. I am operating dash 8's so that's still only about 20 percent of capacity.
First of all: if you have activated your flights yesterday, it will take 3 days until the planes start flying.
Second: the answer to your question why you cannot change the transfer possibility of your hub is that it is not possible. Very simple.
Third: to understand the game, you should watch available tutorials on youtube and written tutorials here in the forum. Search for "AS for beginners" and you will find informations.
A question for you: how do you think should a simulation know that there are plans to expand a very small airport? And a second question: are there any connections from LEY in real world? I cannot find any flights departing from LEY at all. There is no demand and you will never generate demand there.
Just to be sure; the game is static. An airport in this game, will never grow. Either in size or demand - unless it does in the real world. :-)
If you want a small airport, find a 5-bar airport, with possibility of transfering. That’s a funny task. But as highscore mentioned, make sure you know the game mechanics, before embarking on such an adventure.
First of all: if you have activated your flights yesterday, it will take 3 days until the planes start flying.
Second: the answer to your question why you cannot change the transfer possibility of your hub is that it is not possible. Very simple.
Third: to understand the game, you should watch available tutorials on youtube and written tutorials here in the forum. Search for "AS for beginners" and you will find informations.
A question for you: how do you think should a simulation know that there are plans to expand a very small airport? And a second question: are there any connections from LEY in real world? I cannot find any flights departing from LEY at all. There is no demand and you will never generate demand there.
How does the game determine the demand an airport has?
LEY currently has no demand because, well, there are no scheduled flights departing from there (only general aviation). However it is located not far away from Amsterdam so it should make sense to me that there should be some 'growth' curve' to demad, right? Though it has no demand right now it has the potential to gain demand as it is located not too far away from a very large city.
You are giving you the answer yourself... No demand in real life, no demand in the game.
I don't understand why you are still asking for "growth curve" if there is no demand in real life. A location not too far away from Amsterdam means that people will take a train or a car to travel to AMS (LEY is part of ground network for AMS) and not take a plane from there to anywhere - unless someone will decide to expand this tiny little airport with a very shot runway to a medium sized airport and some airlines choose LEY as their new destination.
You are giving you the answer yourself... No demand in real life, no demand in the game.
I don't understand why you are still asking for "growth curve" if there is no demand in real life. A location not too far away from Amsterdam means that people will take a train or a car to travel to AMS (LEY is part of ground network for AMS) and not take a plane from there to anywhere - unless someone will decide to expand this tiny little airport with a very shot runway to a medium sized airport and some airlines choose LEY as their new destination.
Which is exactly what I have done, right? I have taken the unused airport (the runway is not much shorter than say london city, by the way) and added flights to many destinations. Naturally shouldn't that generate *some* traffic?
I mean I don't immediately expect 100 per cent full planes. But I would expect a bit more than 0 passengers.
No as there is no demand on that airport. There are no commercial flights in real world hence there is no demand. And you can not generate the demand as Banff described it. Expansion was meant to happen in real world and not here in the game.
Seems to me like a missed game play opportunity. Maybe I'll just start over.
Could one-stop same plane services via smaller airpots work though? Or will people nt make the flight all the way but always get off at the intermediate point?
I don't understand what you want to know. If you are flying A-B-C, then there might be passengers who want to fly to B only and some who want to fly to C.
To understand this, please watch the tutorials and read available posts. If I were you, I would search for a spot with an airport with at least 7 bars and slot availability of at least 60% to start an airline. Build a good network and generate connections and your airline will survive.
Hmm well I'm going to try another airline game (airline empires) and see which of the two I like best.
I enjoyed laying out my routes and all, but if demand is a static given then you can't really get anything to work other than the standard routes that are already in existence. Maybe I'll return to this later.
This may be the difference to other airline games: AS is a simulation based on real world facts. Said this, of course it is possible to fly not only standard routes. To understand this, you need to learn the mechanics of the simulation. That's why I am repeating that you should watch the tutorials on youtube... If you expect a browser game which gives you all possibilities and you want to create an airline which can fly whatever routes, then Airline Sim is not the right choice for you. :)
Yes, the demand between two airports is mostly static (apart from some ups and downs with the AGEX).
But, by offering connections through a hub, you can reroute demand that would normally fly direct to fly via your hub. The more and better connections you have, the more traffic you will grasp from other routes. Now for this to work, the airport must allow transferring passengers. Without that, it won’t work.
And similar to real world, pax won’t fly a long detour. So people arriving from north will most likely depart southwards, or vice versa. Therefor it’s ideal to have the hub more or less in the center of your network.
Could one-stop same plane services via smaller airpots work though? Or will people nt make the flight all the way but always get off at the intermediate point?
it could work, but the ORS rating for flight with one-stop connection maxed at 75 points vs direct flight which could have max rating of 100 points.
your one-stop same plane service might be less preferred by the passengers, if they have better direct flight options.
Hmm well I'm going to try another airline game (airline empires) and see which of the two I like best.
I enjoyed laying out my routes and all, but if demand is a static given then you can't really get anything to work other than the standard routes that are already in existence. Maybe I'll return to this later.
I was once addicted to AE, and in my opinion you can't really compare free game to paid game. If you're on free AS game, you might miss the powerful ORS feature that AS has to offer, as I believe it's not included in free AS. AS is so much more complex and realistic (and thus arguably a lot more fun and exciting) than AE. I believe AE also plan for time-table around the time I left, so they might have it now, not so sure.
But at least in AS, instead of simply flying all possible city pairs from your hub, you must plan carefully what aircraft you want to fly to where and at what time. The key in AS is to build network of connecting flights, while short haul trunk routes might work without connecting passengers, your thinner longer routes might need every connecting traffic it could find to make it viable.
In AS the game run in real world time, so plenty of time to really go into detail and enjoy building a realistic virtual airline. The developer of this game is also actively developing the game, within a year we saw some of our wish list implemented and they add even more. So for now, I'm a happy customer and definitely would recommend this game to people looking for a serious airline business simulation.
which is explained in the tutorials I was mentioning before.
My dear friend, not everyone keen to follow the tutorials on the first go. They need to have at least like some of the game aspects first before delving deeper for more serious play. I quit on my first try in AS, because the real time used seems to be like forever and your flight only depart full in approximately 3 days (after maximum ORS cycles).
The game should be more first-time user-friendly, it's easy to follow step by step development as long time player, but I could imagine how steep the learning curve for the beginner. As always, while still could be too much for first timer, this should be mandatory reading for new AS player: http://community.airlinesim.aero/topic/8123-as-for-beginners-an-attempted-blog/
And long time player should not get tired pointing this to them, I remember when I first started here, everyone is more friendly. We should welcome new player and not scare them away. New player bring more airline to partner and compete, and make more money to the developer, both are good for the game. :D
Indeed I much enjoy the complexity of airline sim after trying a bit of airline empires.
Let's see maybe I'll just start over.
so welcome back :lol:
just a word of caution, like all other game, some veteran players here know the game mechanic pretty well and able to bend the rules to the edge of the gray area.. that's my friend, is an area you don't wanna go.. never seduced to the dark side of the force.. :ph34r:
LEY is just impossible to run a successful operation in, maybe a daily LET flight to AMS, FRA, LHR and CDG would work but nothing more. The runway is also extremely short limiting your operation to Props or Avros.
I have run quite a successful operation out of NYO but the growth possibilities are very limited. I suggest running small scale and don't care at all about making a wave system and instead fully utilise your aircraft. At one point I had 15 Saab 2000, 20 Saab 34s and 2 CRJ 700s based in NYO flying to most airports over 3 bars in Scandinavia. The operation made about 1 to 2 million dollars every week and load factors where around 80%. Though most of my flights were to my main hub GOT or to my friends airline Air Geneva´s hubs connecting to his waves. I also operated many commuter flights for Air Geneva flying directly from his hubs to feed his main network. I decided after being advised by my mentor to end my BMA and NYO operations and solely focus on GOT and ARN operations in Scandinavia and my feeder flights for Air Geneva in Italy and France. This airline ran a very basic profile with not that good seats and low pricing. Read this for more information about this regional.
Seems to me like a missed game play opportunity. Maybe I'll just start over.
Could one-stop same plane services via smaller airpots work though? Or will people nt make the flight all the way but always get off at the intermediate point?
There was a recent discussion a few months back, where proposals were made to be able to expand airports, build new runways or expand existing ones, and otherwise make improvements to run connections on dormant airports. Or in other words, to "generate demand" as you described it (with the same premise that as more flights are based to/from the airport, the airport becomes itself more attractive, more businesses relocate to the area because of better air service connections, etc.) Most responders on that thread shot down that kind of idea as "unrealistic" and preferred to remain "copying the real world".
My dear friend, not everyone keen to follow the tutorials on the first go. They need to have at least like some of the game aspects first before delving deeper for more serious play. I quit on my first try in AS, because the real time used seems to be like forever and your flight only depart full in approximately 3 days (after maximum ORS cycles).
Same thing happened to me, my first attempt was very short lived and I got put off after learning my aircraft will arrive to my base next day, tomorrow! It takes some time getting used to real time concept in AS.